Room for improvement.

[promhandicam]

I think with what has been posted up recently I will be able to improve my SU models, if not the 2D drawings I send to my customers.

This is one of the latest designs - and no I'm not blatantly copying Jon's unit - the customer already has a room divider with random shelves and wants an alcove unit to match

View from the front - sent to customer



and from the back



I'm hoping that if I make my designs using components in the same way that the thing will actually be made then it will be easier to show different details - like hiding doors to show the interior layout of a unit.

One question - any pointers to tutorials on how to easily place a model into a generic room to make it more realistic?

Cheers,

[daver]

Steve,

Where shall we start?

First just a couple of things about SketchUp in general. When you see faces colored blue in the style you have chosen, you are seeing the back sides. When I work with students on this side of the pond, I tell them to think of A/C grade plywood. The A face is the good side which we want to see. The C face is the not good side and we want that to be hidden on the side away from us. You should work to have the white side exposed and the blue on the other side. Now, in your case, since the walls have no thickness it would be normal to see all blue faces in your view of the outside of the room.

Next, what you see on the outside is normal for the way you approached drawing it. This method can be quick but it makes it difficult to make modifications and certainly more difficult if you wish to make construction docs later.

So here's how I would approach this at the proposal stage which it sounds like you're at.

1. Draw the floorplan of the room and the walls to the proper height. I would leave out the ceiling and I'd probably really only draw a little bit of the left and right walls at least to start. If there are unmovable details such as windows, trim, electrical, etc. Put those in. You don't need a lot of detail at this stage so keep it simple.
2. Make the room a component.
3. Mentally divide the project into sub-assemblies. For this one I would say there are base cabinets, maybe a "counter top" and the shelving above.
4. Draw in the base cabinets starting with a rectangle on the floor and using Push/Pull to bring it up to the height just below the counter top. Use the Line, Rectangle and Push/Pull to draw details such as the base molding (add a 'u' to suit. ) and the frame and panel doors. Will there be face frames or are these the frameless kind?
5. When you get the base cabs pretty well roughed in, make them a component. Triple click on the cabinet with Select to select all of it before making the component.
6. Draw a rectangle on the top of the cabinet, pull it up with Push/Pull, pull the front edge out a bit if there'll be an overhang.
7. Make the counter top a component.
8. Repeat the process to make the shelves above. You can draw a big box between the counter top and the top of the wall, add lines for the shelves and use Push/Pull to eliminate the waste.
9. Make the shelves a component.

At this point you should have something to show that will get the point across to the client. They should be able to understand what you understand them to want. You can modify parts of the project without affecting other parts. For example, perhaps they decide they'd like drawers in the center section of the base unit instead of doors. You can open that component for editing (don't explode it) and make the changes as needed.

Once you have the final sign off from the client you can start adding whatever details you need to build the thing but that'll be for another post. Let's get the proposal drawings finished first.

One note about proposal drawings. This is just my preference but I like to use some sketchy line style early in the process to avoid giving the customer even the least idea that the design is fixed, carved in stone, if you will. I also tend to avoid adding materials leaving the drawings as simple line drawings. As the design of the project gets farther along and closer to finalized, I tighten t he line style up. I also like to keep details to a minimum early on so if the client walks after getting my early drawings, another cabinetmaker doesn't get enough details to simply hand the client a price. I don't mean to be rude but if the client is going to shop around, I want the other guy to do some work for the job, too.

[mark270981]

Dave

I've always made groups and not components, is this the wrong way of doing it?

[daver]

Mark, groups are necessarily wrong. At least you are separating parts from each other. As far my work flow goes, there is never been a case where a group made more sense than a component. Components have a lot of things going for them that groups don't.

If you unwittingly delete a group and don't catch it until it is late for Undo, it's gone. A component would still be available in the In Model component library. There's no In Model group library.
If you have multiple copies of a part in your model but you made them groups, you'll need to touch each one to modify them. If you made components, edit one and they all get edited at the same time.
Components can be given names upon creation.
Components can be given attributes such as gluing and hole cutting.
Components can be saved for later use in other models.
The insertion point of components can be set by the user.
Some people teach that you should make groups unless there's more than one in the model. To me that doesn't make sense. You have two different processes to use as you go. And you wind up with a bunch of parts all identified as "Group". Imagine a list of parts to make in the shop and they're all called the same thing.
some people teach that you should make a group of every part and then, if you make a copy of it, convert it to a component. Again. This makes no sense to me. This adds a step of complexity to drawing the model. It's easy to make an error. You can't tell simply by looking at a thing if it is a group or a component. If you do this you end up with a bunch of components called 'Group'. That's not very useful.

I've had some folks tell me that they would make the legs of a table components but a table top would be a group because the table only has one top. That works to that point although you wind up with four 'legs' and a 'group.' Now suppose you want to create an exploded view of the table in the model space. You make a copy of the parts and move them off to one side. Next, using Move, you move the parts away from each other. Cool! Now, the client says, "I'd like the table to be 150mm longer and I want it to be rounded on the ends." Now there are two table tops in the model. Either these folks have to edit both table tops individually or they edit one and copy it to replace the other or they have to remember to make them both components and related components at that. Since I would have made the top a component from the beginning, I just edit the top and move on.

'G' is the keyboard shortcut for Create Component. It's easy to hit and if you don't care about giving the component a name, hit Enter after the 'G'.

In the case of Steve's project here, it might make editing the cabinet easier if he gets it away from the rest of the model. If he makes a component of it, he can pull out a copy with Move/Copy (Move with Ctrl on PC or Option on Mac) and place that copy out away from the rest of the model. When he opens it and makes his changes, he'll know the one that is still in place in the room is getting the same treatment. There's no need to put the cabinet back into the room because it never left. The copy is sort of the voodoo doll. Whatever he does to it is "felt" by the real thing. The copy can be deleted if desired after editing and closing it.

There's a lot more but I'm babbling.

[mark270981]

thats a good explanation thanks Dave

I will try making components in future and see what that does for me - Makes perfect sense.

[daver]

Mark, I'm glad that helped.

FWIW, you might take a look at the video here. You'll be able to see some ways I leverage components. I also did a video showing the drawing of a little fern stand in which the use of components was very important. the two videos aren't intended as beginner's tutorials but rather show my workflow.

[Big_JD]

Dave, I too tended to use groups rather than components (unless I specifically wanted to edit several together), but I'm convinced enough to try a new way of thinking after reading this. And I really like the idea of doing the work on the "voodoo doll" away from the actual model, which can often be confusing and requires "hiding" of other groups/components, floors or walls. Do the work on the clone, then delete it will be my new mantra.

Many thanks, John.